Dylan Greene dot com

Clinton pulled out of Somalia after getting US troops killed.

Bush didn't pull out of Iraq after getting US troops killed.

This is a fun game. :-)

Lemme see....

Clinton awards Halliburton no-bid contract in Yugoslavia - good...

Bush awards Halliburton no-bid contract in Iraq - bad...

Clinton spends 77 billion on war in Serbia - good...

Bush spends 87 billion in Iraq - bad...

Clinton imposes regime change in Serbia - good...

Bush imposes regime change in Iraq - bad...

Clinton bombs Christian Serbs on behalf of Muslim Albanian terrorists - good...

Bush liberates 25 million from a genocidal dictator - bad...

Clinton bombs Chinese embassy - good....

Bush bombs terrorist camps - bad....

Clinton commits felonies while in office - good...

Bush lands on aircraft carrier in jumpsuit - bad...

Clinton says mass graves in Serbia - good...

Entire world says WMD in Iraq - bad...

Stock market crashes in 2000 under Clinton - good...

Recession under Bush - bad...

Clinton refuses to take custody of Bin Laden - good...

World Trade Centers fall under Bush - Bad...

Clinton calls for regime change in Iraq - good...

Bush imposes regime change in Iraq - bad...

Terrorist training in Afghanistan under Clinton - good...

Bush destroys training camps in Afghanistan - bad...

No mass graves found in Serbia - good...

No WMD found Iraq - bad...

Milosevic in Custody but not yet convicted - good...

Saddam in custody - bad...

Ah, yes, a very fun game...!

#2, your's aren't very good

Go # 2!

For #2, I would like to see some of your references.

77 billion in Serbia vs 87 billion in Iraq? Somethings not right there.

The "Christian" Serbs were the ones attacking the Albanians, smart guy.

What felonies did Clinton commit? Is a blow job a felony?

When did the entire world say that Iraq had WMDs?

And last but not least, Bush refuses to get Bin Laden also. There is no way our military is so incompetent that we just haven't caught him yet. At least Clinton was honest about it.

Blow Job is not a felony, lying under oath is.

The intelligence agencies of France, Russia, Germany, Britain, and the USA all said Saddam had WMDs. So you are right, not the entire world.

Please present your evidence that Bush has had a chance to take Bin Laden and refused.

Clinton did tight thing in KOSOVO, and there is only one real Clinton, BILL CLINTON.

Bush also has lied under oath. He's lied about his drunk driving records, drug usage, company fraud, and millitary service... Thats not counting lieing to the entire world with documents from 1992, claiming Iraq had recently aquired these weapons and needed to be dealt with... Also, Clinton knew when to pull out of an area.. Clinton left office with hardly any troops stuck in foriegn terrority.. We'll be lucky if we're out of Iraq and Afghanastan in 20 years. Thats if we are lucky.

#2 doesn't have to have facts.. c'mon guys.. this is the new age of democracy, sticking to "the facts" shows our weakness in our ability to adapt, 2K was an obvious change in human events in history, alot of us grew up in history classes in HS learning of the great roman empires, the developement of the modern day calender we still use, being dated as B. C. (before Christ) & A. D. (after death).. personally I think Dubya will make a surprise annoucement in this yr's state of the union address that he's decided to reform the calender yr, much like social security.. we kinda already have by dismissing history to an '.. '05 for instance.. we can't be bothered to have to type 2005.. c'mon..

so anything before 2000 should be considered B.D. (before Diebold), and thenseforth, A.C. (after Clinton).. anything to make things easier for our precious kids, having actual thoughts can be confusing to them..

wake up America, our bickering now bores me.. the gap between the haves & have not's is as serious issue just now coming to light.. this new year's been a time of leveling, the pendulam swinging back again.. America's superstars actually giving back wealth, outta feelings of guilt, seeing the weapons of mass destruction this planet we all live on's dealt to millions less fortunate..

well there, I've spoken my peace.. pray for #2.. a mind's a terrible thing to waste, it happens tho sadly.. & too often these days..

the truth's out there..

ACCOMPLISHMENTS of PRESIDENT GEORGE W. BUSH

1) Reaching office of President of the United States without even being elected.

2) Taking the strongest economy in United States history and causing it to plummet

to the largest deficit.

3) Giving huge tax breaks to corporations who continue to ship jobs overseas. Also to those who had the top 1% income.

4) Spending the United States surplus and bankrupting the Treasury.

5) Attacking and occupying a sovereign nation against the will of the United Nations.

6) Getting congress to pass the Patriot Act, threatening the 1st, 4th, 5th, 8th, and 14th Amendments.

7) Withdrawing from the World Court of Law.

8) Being the first president to have gone AWOL.

9) Changing United States policy allowing convicted criminals to be awarded government contracts.

10) Obtaining the most corporate campaign donations in United States history.

11) Lowering our clean air and water standards while allowing companies

(who just happen to be contributors to the Bush campaign) to profit from

the weakened regulations.

12) Being the first United States President to enter office with a criminal record.

13) Taking more vacation days than any other United States President in history.

14) Under-funding his so-called No Child Left Behind Act.

15) Cutting health benefits from veterans, and unemployment benefits from out-of-work Americans.

16) Losing a good portion of America's allies, and becoming the greatest threat to world peace.

17) Retaining office for a second term. God Save America!

Clinton invades Kosovo and captures Milosevic.

That is wrong!!!

In 2000, Milosevic has lost the election. His opponent, Kostunica, has won the election .

In the midst of conflicts in Southwest Asia and the Middle East, I cannot help but wonder: Whatever happened to the Balkans?

What about Kosovo? A 78-day bombing campaign was undertaken to "liberate Kosovo's ethnic Albanian population" from the hands of "terror-invoking Serbs."

Why was there no media follow- up of the accomplishments of peace-loving and newly liberated Kosovo Albanians? Quite simply, because there are no accomplishments.

Could it be because the international community made a grave mistake and has now found itself in a quagmire with no solution in sight? Is it possible that some of the very people NATO was trying to "protect" have turned out, in fact, to be terrorists? Yes!

Albanian rebel offensives resulted in bus explosions of NATO- escorted civilian convoys, brutal murders of civilians tending their fields, random sniper attacks, shootings of children swimming in lakes, night beatings and torture of the elderly, and arson - all against Serbian civilians and all under the watchful eyes of the U.S. and international community.

Observations in Kosovo recorded chilling acts from the "peacekeepers" as well. Germany's military contingent used bright yellow tape to mark large Xs on Serbian homes throughout their designated area of responsibility. Similar to the 1940s Nazi-style branding of Jews and other minorities deemed unworthy of life.

Strangely enough, I was the only one who questioned this and personally brought it to the attention of a senior member of the U.S. Army Command Group.

But let's focus on something near and dear to all Americans: attacks on U.S. Army and media personnel. While on a border patrol, monitoring Albanian rebel insurgency, the U.S. unit I was working with came under direct mortar fire in a village named Krivenik. An Associated Press journalist, Kerim Lawton, was seriously injured. I administered first aid and attempted to stop the bleeding from the dozens of shrapnel wounds he incurred, to no avail. He died shortly afterward.

How was this incident portrayed to the media? In a noncommittal diplomatic fashion, officials announced that, "An investigation will take place as to the day's chain of events," from all sides, U.S. Army, NATO and U.N.

Does this seem all too familiar? Is this not mere repetition of scenarios that got the United States involved in both Bosnia and Kosovo in the first place - only later to discover that "smoking gun" incidences were staged? It is interesting how concrete evidence has surfaced, that incidences were staged by the very groups claiming to have been wronged.

Perhaps the international community should be more forthcoming as to who the real Balkans' terrorists are and how they are draining our tax dollars, manpower and resources.

The public has a right to know what is happening in the Balkans.

".....There was no genocide going on in Kosovo when the attack was launched. Cries of "....Serbian aggression and genocide within its own province were being made in the US Congress in April 1998 when only 80 people had died and less than 100,000 internally displaced. At the time of the 1999 attack, 250,000 had and 550,000 Albanians had been displaced....."

No one died when Clinton lied?

I don't think so

No one died when Clinton lied?

I'm not so sure

Could it be that Clinton lied

Not just about Monica?

Let's look at Kosovo

Let's look at Kosovo

Bill said there would be mass graves

But where were they?

Few if any mass graves found

Until Iraq

Slobodan Milosevic

Murdered people, but were they

Enough for genocide?

Enough for genocide?

Bombed the Chinese embassy

Maps outdated

Yes, we killed civilians, too

Like in Iraq

Where have our cruise missiles gone?

Some hit soldiers, some did not

Should we have used them all?

Should we have used them all?

Then we bombed some cardboard tanks

They were decoys

Stealthy fighter was shot down

I wonder how

Said the war would not last long

It took almost eighty days

Much longer than Bill said

Much longer than Bill said

Where have all the graveyards gone?

In Pristina

Where have all the graveyards gone?

In Kosovo

Where have all the graveyards gone?

Covered with Bill Clinton's lie?

Were he and Bush both wrong?

Were he and Bush both wrong?

. However, just as the WMD's didn't turn up in Iraq, the mass graves and "tens of thousands" of genocide victims did not turn up in Kosovo. Instead, the number of Kosovars killed by Milosevic was between 2000 and 3000, and might even be less than the number of people killed by the US/UK bombing. Thus, it is quite possible that the war in Kosovo, and the loss of life therein, may have resulted from a lie. It is also possible that Mr. Bill honestly but wrongly believed what he said about mass graves and dead Kosovars. I will gladly give him the benefit of the doubt when Dubya's critics do the same for him.

I have a friend named Blogless Mike. Blogless Mike has a stronger constitution than I do, so I asked him to keep an eye on the cable shouting and radio-blustering. "Let me know if anything particularly egregious is making the rounds," I said. And so Blogless Mike tells me that a lot of people are defending Bush's failure to find Weapons of Mass Destruction by comparing it to Clinton's failure to find the promised "100,000 dead Albanians" (or "100,000 mass graves," depending on whom you're listening to). Here are a couple of examples:

Larry Elder: Not that his supporters care, but Clinton apparently exaggerated the suffering in Kosovo. In November 1999, the Christian Science Monitor wrote, "U.S. and NATO officials at times implied that as many as 100,000 ethnic Albanians may have been killed, and they used words like 'genocide' to describe the Serbian policy. They later lowered the estimate to 10,000. But preliminary findings from war-crimes investigators indicate that the number of ethnic Albanians killed by Serbian forces during the air strikes was probably closer to 5,000 on both sides" [ Where were Bush's critics during Kosovo? ]

Rep. Curt Weldon (R-Penn): If Senator Kennedy wants to talk about fraud, he ought to talk about Chappaquiddick or he ought to talk about what he and President Clinton told us in 1999 when they told us to bomb innocent Serbs, wed find 100 thousand mass graves. Those mass graves were never found. [ Rep. Curt Weldon (R-Pennsylvania) on Hardball, September 19, 2003 ]

Note that the CSM quote above is comparing the total number of ethnic Albanians killed over an unspecified time period to those who were probably killed by Serbs during American air strikes. Despite an hour and a half on Google, I have yet to find any direct, cited, or transcript quote from Clinton or anyone else insisting that one hundred thousand Albanians were killed by Serbs *during the airstrikes.* According to The Guardian, the number of bodies exhumed from mass graves as of August 21, 2003 is around 3,500, both Serbs and Albanians.

Likewise, the only sources I found for Rep. Curt Weldon's "one hundred thousand mass graves" came from mailing list archives and weblog comments from people claiming Clinton made this claim -- none with citations or even so much as a date. I did find a few instances of "one hundred thousand people in a hundred mass graves" -- again, attributed to Clinton by anti-Kosovo-war voices and without citation -- so for the moment I'm assuming this myth has been mangled into Weldon's "one hundred thousand mass graves."

The Congressman says "those mass graves were never found," which might lead someone to believe we haven't found any. But there is no 3,500 bodies found so far. There is bodies 300 in seperate mass graves.Half of taht number are non-Albanians. Fourteen of those graves have been found this year alone. 300 is a lot smaller than 100,000, but since I can't verify that anyone ever actually claimed there were 100,000 mass graves, it doesn't really make a difference. The point is, they're there.

In any case, the implication of the "100,000" claim -- whether it was one hundred thousand bodies or one hundred thousand mass graves -- seems to be that we went to war when there was really no ethnic cleansing attempt being made. This is supposed to justify the Bush war, where we fought over nonexistent WMDs. Of course, we have found mass graves, the UN had already mapped the locations of concentration camps, and we all saw the pictures in Time. Before the war.

But even so, so what? Are Representative Weldon and Mr. Elder suggesting Bush should be allowed to have his "pointless" war and lie about it just because Clinton had his "pointless" war and "lied" about it? What kind of an argument is that? By that logic, Hussein was justified in killing his own people with chemical weapons tests because the U.S. once did medical tests against our own military. Or Hussein should have been allowed to keep Kuwait because we did (after all) take America by force from those who were here before us. Just because one person does something that's not right does not make it permissible for everyone else.

In fact, what the conservatives are trying to suggest is that opposition to Bush is based solely on his political party affiliation and not on philosophical or moral grounds.

But as much as the Right likes to pretend it's not the case, Clinton was heavily criticized by many on the left for his handling of the Kosovo crisis. In fact, a lot of them were making the same criticisms of Clinton they now making of Bush: There wasn't enough planning, there wasn't enough dialogue, we're only there to protect our own interests, and/or we're just there to feed the military-industrial complex. ( I found too many quotes to use here, but I've placed some samples on my own site. ) The progressive Left's arguments against the wars (both of them) have not changed.

That kind of consistency and willingness to fire on your own side has not been demonstrated by this administration, which was opposed to Nation Building under Clinton (Bush) and expansion of FBI survellance powers (Ashcroft), but changed their tunes quickly when they came to power.

But those of us who did support one and not the other see significant differences between the Clinton justification and the Bush justification. For starters, "100,000 dead" was just one detail in eight years of public reports against Serbs, of concentration camps, mass executions, forced immigration, and other attempts at facistic ethnic cleansing. We could see starvation and refugee camps. The case had been made for nearly a decade. But is it all true!?

What happend 1 year ago!?

http://www.kosovo.com/news_pogrom.html

Clinton: american public wondering if he slept with Monica.

Bush: every one wondering why tower 7 came down? and why did the so called 757 hit the west wing of the pentagon when all the head honchos are in the east wing?

Now i ask you! which one of the above would you rather wonder about? Massive damages and life loss, or soap opera stuff.

personally i would rather worry about the clinton scandal. I mean, many lives lost in 9/11, and we weren't even at war yet. Then he waited for OSAMA to turn himself in. If you were Osama, would you turn yourself in? He used all the time that we wasted waiting for him, to successfully escape. Thank god he can only be in office for a few more years.

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